Forum Activity for @Clayton Smith

Hi guys, I've been using a Kitchener wine fridge to set my chocolate over the summer months and it's worked great. Although the room can get up to 28Celsius (82Farheneit), the fridge has been keeping itself at the desired 20C (68F). However, now that it's winter (I'm in Australia), the temperatures are beginning to drop. My Kitchener wine fridge does not have a heating element to it, so it is now simply adopting the temperature of the room, which isn't getting above 15C (59F).

Can any one see that there would be a problem with the temperature of the fridge not reaching the desired 20C? Obviously there is no humidity to worry about, but once we really get into winter the room will get into the 5C (41F) and below territory.

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Clayton

Okay I understand.

Thanks for the insight!

To follow on with what Sebastian has said, there is no "one, true" temperature for dark chocolate, one for milk chocolate, and one or white chocolate. Every chocolate will have its own set of working temperatures ... but those may change depending on the ambient temperature and humidity and the method of tempering being used. In large industrial processing situations they can control these variables very closely, but in the average small chocolate kitchen it's a different story.

In my experience, there is no substitute for being able to hand temper and to know what tempered chocolate looks like and how it behaves. You use that experience to help you arrive at the temperatures that work for you.

The answer is 'it depends' 8-) there's a great deal here posted already on tempering, so i'll not rehash that - you'll need to do some digging here to find it. But suffice it to say that due to differences in cocoa butter compositions (not all cocoa butters are equal), and the influence of other soft fats (milk fat, nut fats, emulsifiers, etc), and 'degree of temper' - you're going to end up with a range. Very sophisticated operations have the ability to control their raw materials streams and the knowledge to narrow down that range quite a bit, but for the average joe, that's just not necessary

I read about tempering in different resources and I see different temperatures stated.

For dark chocolate, some online articles say melt to 55c, others 45c.
The book I read "Chocolates & Confections" say 50c.

Why are the differences? What are the true temperatures for dark, milk and white?

Thanks!

You need to begin with cocoa liquor, and partially defat it somehow (most use high pressure hydraulic presses). That resluts in a very hard wheel of mostly cocoa solids that needs to be ground up into a powder. Adding cocoa butter back sort of defeats the purpose of taking it out in the first place. adding liquid sweeteners to chocolate is always a hard thing to do. adding a liquid sweetener to defatted cocoa powder - depending on how defatted it really is - can be much easier (think chocolate syrup)

What are your thoughts aboutmaking chocolate from cacao powder + cocoa butter + liquid sweetener?

What is the resulting quality of chocolate?
Does it require grinding or conching?
Can you layout or direct me to a basic recipe for ratios of powder-butter-sweetener?

Thanks!

sorry for the delay I just saw this message. The machine they quoted me was a lab scale bean to bar.

Without revealing the price of the machines, can you provide links to pages where the equipment that has been quoted to you can be seen for us to evaluate?

Semira -

I have seen quotes of US$500,000 to over US$1,000,000 for complete lines from European manufacturers for production in this daily amount.

On the other hand, I have seen workshops with 500kg/day production where the investment in equipment is under $300,000 - so we're talking a lot more than a couple of thousands of dollars.

The quote was from Duyvis. They told me they acquired the company about two months ago. I am sure the price will be higher now than just from a manufacturer from Brazil. I have tried to do as much research but the sizes are much more smaller. I don't mind paying a couple of grands more for a good machinery. My plan is to supply our local pastry chefs, artisan chocolatiers, ptisseries, restaurants, caterers and hotels a premium line of single origin and blended chocolates. In the mean while I could set up my chocolate shop.

JAF Inox is a Brazilian company that was recently purchased by Duyvis-Wiener, as Sebastian pointed out.

One of the things that this has done is to increase the price of the machines significantly, at least outside of Brazil - the other thing it has done is extended the delivery times as well.

There are many ways to produce chocolate in the 300-500kg per day range you mention. There are big differences in price as well as the amount of integration (materials handling) that is and can be done. So, Sebastian is right - we need to know more about what you want to do, the equipment you are looking at, and your budget, to be able to offer more informed opinions.

I've never used them, but they appear to have been purchased by Duyvis, which is a very well established company i've used for decades. if you post the specific pieces of equipment you're looking at and what you'd like them to do, we could perhaps comment in greater detail.

Hello everyone, This is my first post after months of following the site. I am interested in opening a Bean to Bar chocolate company and I would like to know if anyone has used Jafinox bean to bar machinery? I'm looking to produce about 300 kg to 500kg chocolate a day.

TIA

I think that'd result in something very different than conventional alkalized cocoa powder as you know it today.

Thank you for your reply SeBastian,

I think if I want to make my own natural chocolate to dutched chocolate. I will just need to add 3 tablespoonsunsweetened cocoa powderplus a pinch (1/8 teaspoon) baking soda for every 1-ounce Dutch-Process Cocoa. Am I correct?

The details of how to perform alkalization, my friend, i'm afraid are going to be closely guarded trade secrets. Essentially it involves soluabilizing an alkalization agent in the presence of cocoa solids, variables include the alkali, concentration, time, temperature, state of the cocoa at the time of alkalization, pressure, moisture content, atmosphere, etc.

Be careful should you attempt this, as alkali can cause severe chemical burns if not handled properly or not effectively neutralized.

Most people prefer alkalized powder in their beverages over natural powder.

I know that the 2 main ingredients for dutching are Chocolate, alkalizingagent. Dutch-process cocoa powders and chocolate liquors are treated at the nib, liquor, or powder stage. *which stage and how to perform such process on chocolate* or just simply add a small portion of a alkalizing agent to chocolate during pressing stage? And will dutchingchocolate powder taste better as instant hot chocolate drink vs natural chocolate powder?

Thank you in advance!

Siham,

unfortunatly I am not so experienced with batch tempering machines. I work in a company that can produce continuous tempering machines.

The main difference is that heating and cooling (in one word: tempering chocolate) are made contemporary, in a continuous temperer. While in a batch temperer you have to melt and then temper. For what I know (because till 2003 we used to produce one batch tempering unit), you have to use the tempered chocolate in a determined time to be able not to loose the tempering curve. While in conotuous system, chocolate that is not used go back into the melting bowl and it is heated again.

Batch tempering machine are, in general, less expansive than continuous. I am not sure this difference in price is kept if you start considering the enrobing features too.

Again, everything depends on you. Your production (continuous temperer are more productive) but budget too.

Giuseppe

Hi Giuseppe,

I would like to purchase my first tempering machine to use at home for molds and enrobing.

A batch machine that is big enough to shell 4-8 molds/ batch.

I am thinking of chocovision rev 2 1.5 lb capacity or ACMC tabletop 6 lb capacity. A big difference in the capacity for almost the same price. Also, I am not sure if I should start with chocovision mini or rev 1, same capacity of rev 2 for half the price!

Thanks,

Siham

Hi Siham,

the question is not which is the right tempering machine size but what are you planning to do. I mean: kind of product and/or productivity.

Every machine has its own price, for sure, but, if you want a continuous tempering machine you will find useful also the accessories that allow a good range of products. Normally the bigger is the machine the easier is to add new accessories. Furthermore different capcacity (machine size) different production rate.

I would say, first of all, do you want a continuous tempering machine or a batch machine?

Then: variaty of products (example:molding and enorbing / bars and pralines), and how many products and chocolate per day or month.

Giuseppe

Thank you so much Ben, I will read through the links to learn more before buying.

Siham

Hi Siham. There are several discussions on this forum discussing tempering machines and people's opinions of them. I'm linking a couple of them below, but there are many more that you can search for.

-Ben

http://www.thechocolatelife.com/forum/topics/chocovision-x3210-or-delta-good-for-bean-to-bar

http://www.thechocolatelife.com/forum/topics/which-tempering-machine-to-purchase-fbm-gami-selmi-or-wheel-type

http://www.thechocolatelife.com/forum/topics/1978963:Topic:14103

Hi everyone,

I am looking for a small - med size tempering machine, any advice!

Thanks,

Siham

ADM's chocolate business for sale, again. This time they mean it 8-)

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/04/15/us-adm-cocoa-deals-idUSBREA3E1ZK20140415

Actually, they meant it last time as well, but ADM was hoping to purchase a large grain business based in Australia, and the sale of the cocoa/chocolate business was meant to fund that. Australia decided they didn't want a non-aussie owner of that large of a business, so the deal fell through, creating a bit of an embarrassing scenario as they could no longer sell the unit, but already had announced the intent to do so. I'm guessing employee engagement's not at an all time high at those facilities. I suspect that including the cocoa elements in a sale - which is almost certainly going to have Cargill as the buyer - creates very difficult regulatory issues, so ADM's kept the more profitable cocoa sector and is peeling off their chocolate business, including the almost entirely empty (thanks to the BC outsourcing deal), but brand spankin' new, hazelton facility.

Hi everyone,

My Name is Francis Boechat. I am a proud manufacturer of Brigadeiros, a Brazilian sweet that takes chocolate as a main ingredient. Now I would like to expand my business and sell my sweets frozen. For this, I need a box for truffles that could go in the freezer. Could anyone help me with this, please?

thanks for the response. yeah, I'm seeing quite a bit of mold that's made its way inside the bean. No fun

very common. ecuador's a terribly difficult place to dry beans properly, so a great deal of them mold. if you don't have the proper relationships and controls in place, those beans will find their way to you. there's a saying in the ivory coast that's applicable here - it roughly translates to " there's no graveyard for cocoa beans" - meaning all beans will find their way somewhere other than the trash.

Don't worry so much about surface mold - what's important is if the mold has penetrated the bean. cut 100 of them in half and if more than 5 or 6 of them are moldy inside, then you have a problem.

I just bought a few kilos of beans from a local distributer and noticed that in the sack from Ecuador there were some pretty bizarre looking beans (totaling less than 10%, I would say), at least compared to other beans I've had before. Quite a few of the them had white specks on the outside/inside (mold?), were hollow or looked like they had been eaten by something, or were cut in half. There were also a handful of pea sized, shrunken beans and a few that looked like they had germinated. I'm just curious if this is common when buying beans in bulk. I added a picture below. Also, I apologize if I posted this in the wrong place. I did a search but didn't find a recent/related thread. I'm new here (and new to chocolate making). Thanks!

You can find some brief details here .

Observing a tree at our farm during an partially immobilizinginjury and reading all about theobroma cacao got me hooked on it... now I propagate high yield clones and naturalized trees at my own nursery/farm. I do micro batches for my own consumption as roasted nibs. No chocolate yet.

Dirke! That is awesome! I love this stuff - it's so true of the way chocolate works, isn't it? We're just living our lives, minding our own business and suddenly we're swept away with a seemingly innocent taste.

Which turns into an idea, which turns into a fascination, which turns into a lifestyle. Thanks for taking the time to respond. I'd love to taste your chocolate sometime! Is it awine/chocolate combo?

For me, I have always been a foodie but chocolate was just something I quickly grabbed while waiting at the check out isle at the grocery store. Until of course I did a winery tour and they offered me a tasting of ice wine in a chocolate cup. I loved the combination and of course wanted to share the experience with friends at home but couldn't find the cups anywhere. That lead me to trying to make my own and that's where I starting playing with chocolate, quickly finding it very interesting with the desire to learn more.

As I played with chocolate and discovered new combinations while learning the science behind it all, I found it a natural fit. I was so intrigued by it that I bought and read endless books about it and eventually went to school for it. My friends (aka guinea pigs) loved what I made and wanted to buy them, so I eventually built a business around it. I am lucky to have found something I am so passion about other then my family. But I am also fortunate enough to have a family that supports my crazy ways. I am a chocolatier, I love what I do. There is much more to this story but this is the general gist of it.

Cheers

The Chocolate Tourist is all about the stories behind chocolate makers and what motivates an artisan's passion to work with beans.

For me, it all started with an atypical northern Virginia snowstorm that kept mehousebound for two days. I started experimenting withhot chocolate recipes and was suddenly seized with a burning desire to know all about chocolate - where it comes from and its cultural significance and what goes into the bean to bar process.

It's a rabbithole that so farhas not presented a bottom!

I'd love to find out where my fellow Chocolate Lifers are coming from. What's your story?

I am still trying to find this, I am starting to think it doesn't exist unless you have $30,000+ to play with. Let me know if you find anything...

Does anyone have a suggestion about a machine we can use for wrapping bars? A cold seal machine? It is ok to have it manual, but I want something to speed up production. We are trying to stay under $2000. Any advice is most welcome.

That sounds awful! I haven't used it enough to be able to recommend or not recommend, but the chocolate I have been making so far has turned out really good. I have to say, if I felt like there was an alternative I would certainly purchase from someone else.

What size belt does it use?

As far as I know, they don't make the power twist in the size required by the ECGC-65 (at least they didn't when I bought my replacement belts).

I concur though that for the santha's they are a must.

As has been suggested by Paul and in other discussions here on TCL, take a look at Power Twist fiberglass link belts. They don't stretch and seem to last forever. I used 3 small cocoatown melangers for a few years without having to change or even tighten the belt.

Thanks, you guys - I will definitely look into getting a different belt. Moral of the story being, once you buy a CocoaTown don't plan on utilizing their customer service :)